tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8805323468407241809.post1044563331156651154..comments2023-12-17T05:54:56.396-05:00Comments on I'm Unschooled. Yes, I Can Write.: I'm Not Bill Gates. I'm Still An Autodidact (and So Are You).Idzie Desmaraishttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12782266545123946006noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8805323468407241809.post-50899574650196646082017-05-06T14:45:07.535-04:002017-05-06T14:45:07.535-04:00I love your writing - very thoughtful and on point...I love your writing - very thoughtful and on point. We have been unschooling our autistic son for the past three years and have found that, yes, anyone can be autodidactic. In the case of autistic people, instead of constantly trying to force them to learn things which are of no interest, they can really dive into their very specific interests and use them to develop skills (often autism therapy discourages intense interests as distracting from "typical" or "age appropriate" ones". For example, my son has always been into alphabets and numbers. This led to an intense interest in fonts. From this, he developed an interest in font design, foreign alphabets (and other languages) and graphic design - which led to video editing and animation. He's used the internet and his own curiosity to teach himself most of the Adobe Suites, iMovie, VideoPad, Sony Vegas Pro and Blender. His visual interest also led to him taking art lessons. I trade vocal coaching for Chinese lessons and he attends a hybrid homeschooers' program where he learns from a Waldorf style teacher about life science, Vikings, Greeks and Geometry. In that case, he chose a teacher who inspires him and will happily engage in anything he brings to his classes. With perfect pitch, he also loves music and has been able to take two music classes a week and play in a band (they just recorded their first 6 originals). My son is 11. Autism limits his social and communication skills. Unschooling unlocks his potential. Etchamomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13229993758777218907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8805323468407241809.post-30672193014545705662014-09-02T18:29:39.349-04:002014-09-02T18:29:39.349-04:00Even Bill Gates needed others...someone had to wri...Even Bill Gates needed others...someone had to write the books that got him started down his path. Someone before him gave him knowledge...whether it be in person or through a book. And everyone, given the right environment as toddlers and preschoolers and elementary age can naturally develop skills needed to pursue what is interesting to them to learn. They don't need teachers in the traditional sense. They need more individual attention and opportunities to explore. They no longer need institutions to access information, either. the biggest complaint I hear from teachers/former teachers is teaching is mostly about classroom management. While kids may learn there, their individual needs are rarely met. Sometimes kids just need the right jump start in order to realize they naturally love to learn...at least what suits them best :)<br />NM Gal at Hearthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04380985926461426120noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8805323468407241809.post-13256132002680246392014-08-11T18:57:28.056-04:002014-08-11T18:57:28.056-04:00Your blog is really interesting! You should check ...Your blog is really interesting! You should check out mine at confessionsbyateen.blogspot.com. I think its really good and I post as much as I can. :)Bloggerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05282534439340430345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8805323468407241809.post-62799560144037239152014-08-06T14:36:45.654-04:002014-08-06T14:36:45.654-04:00Thanks for the thoughtful reply!
First, there'...Thanks for the thoughtful reply!<br />First, there's plenty of things we agree on- I'm not emphasizing those as much, because that's not what I feel compelled discuss (I'm kind of disagreeable/argumentative by nature).<br />Also, just to be 100% clear- I'm not trying to tell you what to write about. Even if a small aspect of your perspective could be used by someone who is furthering causes in a way neither of us agree with, that doesn't make you wrong or mean you shouldn't blog about it. <br /><br />Ok, that said... we agree it is ridiculous to view choice as intrinsically bad, but it's also ridiculous to assume that more choice inevitably leads to more happiness / well-being. Choice can be valuable in itself, even if it doesn't lead to happiness.<br /><br />I also feel like the author of the Slate piece did not do the best job summarizing the actual academic article's take on choice, so I was making sure to discuss the original article. That's a habit of mine because in many fields I'm interested in (e.g. public health) the popular media reporting is so atrociously bad compared to the actual original academic article that I simply filter out the journalist's "contributions" (NB: oftentimes, headlines are The Worst this way. After speaking to enough journalists/writers, I've come to realize that it's unwise to respond much to headlines, as the point is mostly to get you to read further. Headlines aren't always written by, and sometimes not even approved by, the authors of articles. I absolutely dislike "Bill Gates is an autodidact. You're probably not" as a sentiment, but I don't hold it against Murphy Paul). In any event, I do think the original academic article makes good points on "choice". They make it clear that they are arguing in favor of a "Goldilocks" level of choice (not too much or too little), where the goal is to improve learning efficiently as measured externally. <br /><br />Of course, even if that's sensible, is "efficient learning as measured externally" the general aim? Not to paint with too broad a brush, but I think that usually in school, it is. Usually in unschooling, it isn't. That's the crux of the matter.<br /><br />The one part of the Slate article which rings true to me, is where Murphy Paul discusses how inefficient and social learning can be, even for a lauded successful autodidact like Bill Gates. Ultimately, what I notice most about this is that society doesn't give everyone the same number of chances to get things wrong, or the same social opportunities. <br />Unschooling worked for me. However I think that if unschooling works for you, you need to be aware that you are special- not because you've got some kind of magic brain superpowers, but because you occupy a relatively privileged place where inefficiencies of learning don't sink you. If you ask me, Murphy Paul is not so much arguing against self-directed learning *as an option* as arguing against tech-enhanced psudeo-autodidactism pretenses that take away educational resources from poor kids. But again, I'm using a fairly specific cultural context to assume that (well, and Murphy Paul's other writings). Beccahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15356974556397009124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8805323468407241809.post-72099808889106353252014-08-05T18:42:25.646-04:002014-08-05T18:42:25.646-04:00Hey Becca!
That's true, but I feel the author...Hey Becca!<br /><br />That's true, but I feel the authors of that paper where using that research in a misleading way. If you sit down in front of someone and list 100 different things they could do, that's paralyzing. But that's not what self-directed learning looks like at all, which the authors didn't seem to grasp. Having people available to help kids narrow their focus when necessary is definitely a good thing, but the idea that a wide range of choices is a bad thing is completely ridiculous in my opinion.<br /><br />The Canadian cultural context is vastly different. The same privatization around schooling and charter schools and all that simply doesn't exist here. However, I am aware that it exists in the US. I'm not a big fan of Gates at all, or the host of other super privileged education tech reformers, and have criticized similar types of views in the uncollege/self-directed education world as well: http://yes-i-can-write.blogspot.ca/2014/03/uncollege-hackschooling-and-when.html This post wasn't meant as a defense of those big name reformers at all. I don't think they have actual children's interests, especially as you say the interests of poor children, at heart. I firmly believe their version of "reform" is more about making money than anything else, so I agree with you there.<br /><br />But, I have a blog with lots of posts. I've covered a wide range of topics, which I hope are a good collection of my views overall. Each post can't cover everything I think on a topic, and can't include a whole bunch of addendums on every possible interpretation of what I'm saying. I don't mean that badly at all, and do appreciate your comment, but I want to point out that in one blog post, I do what I can to make my main points as best I can. In this case, it was a defense of self directed learning, which, no matter what was influencing the author, they were very clearly saying that most people aren't CAPABLE of self directed learning, which I absolutely and completely disagree with. Thus, that's what I focused on.<br /><br />I *do* talk about what supportive learning environments look like. I talk about that all the time! I also try and talk about how to make that more accessible for people. But having chosen to focus specifically on unschooling, I don't really give myself as many opportunities to talk specifically about freeschooling, democratic schooling, learning centers, and self directed learning in schools, all things that help or can help make self directed learning more accessible. I fully, completely and with all my heart support any projects working on those philosophies while seeking to be actually accessible, and find that very exciting. I just write about unschooling because I also find that very exciting, see it as the end goal as such (everyone learning from life, with nothing that looks like the current schooling model), and because that's what I have actual, real life, extensive experience with. It makes sense for me. <br /><br />Nope, I think Bill Gates and his ilk do not really care that much about students. We agree there. But where we disagree, it seems, is that it's important to champion self directed learning as something ALL people deserve, which means challenging ideas such in the article that only "special" people can do it, an idea I might add that to me promotes severe inequality and the idea of some people as smart and motivated and others as not. <br />There are some major problems with the privatization of schools, absolutely. But the way to address that is to talk specifically about the problems of privatizing school, and how Bill Gates isn’t helping. You know what isn’t helpful? Attacking self-directed learning, saying most people can’t manage it (which to me sounds a lot like most people aren’t deserving of freedom of choice), and making it out like self directed learning is the problem. Blame the rich tech reformers, not the philosophies which promote greater freedom of choice, trust, and respect for children.Idzie Desmaraishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12782266545123946006noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8805323468407241809.post-32782493783420884652014-08-05T18:06:30.398-04:002014-08-05T18:06:30.398-04:00I think that the "too many" choices thin...I think that the "too many" choices thing isn't a personal opinion or a philosophical view on freedom. It comes from pretty well established research on happiness (see e.g. http://www.ted.com/talks/barry_schwartz_on_the_paradox_of_choice or http://www.newyorker.com/science/maria-konnikova/bad-good-choices). <br />There are personality traits that make this less of an issue (google "satisfier vs. maximizer" for one example that may play into this phenomenon), and of course very few of us would want to give up what we see as essential freedoms, even if they provided more happiness/well-being. But analysis-paralysis is a real psychological phenomenon.<br /><br />The other thing is that you are totally missing the cultural context of this stuff. Admittedly, the US cultural context may be different from the Canadian one- there are a lot of people trying to privatize public education here.<br />Some people, when they talk about "digital natives" are just thinking of how easily their Millennial friend fixed their laptop! But some people talking about "digital natives" want to pretend that once you've provided a kid a laptop, you are all set. No need to pay teachers or have schools or help them pay for Ninjutsu classes! They have TEH INTERNETS! (*cue inspiring music*). <br />Basically, there's an argument being made by rich white men like Gates that all poor students really need is a laptop (running Windows, of course). The power issue here isn't just students v. teachers, it's about for-profit educational charter school corporations v. poor students. At least, that's what it really looks like on the ground, here in Michigan (80% of our charter schools are run by for-profit corporations). <br /><br />So I do agree with you philosophically, about people having an innate drive to learn. But I think it's worth talking about what a "supportive environment" to learn really looks like and how to get that for more people. I don't know about you, but I don't think the Bill Gates funded KIPP schools look like an autodidact's paradise.Beccahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15356974556397009124noreply@blogger.com